Minutes of February 2007 Meeting

Austin/343
Minutes of the 12th Plenary Meeting of the Austin Group
Feb 27 - Mar 1, 2007, IBM, Austin, Texas.

Attendees

Name	Affiliation	Role
Andrew Josey	The Open Group	Chair
Nick Stoughton	Usenix	SC 22 OR, Secretary
Don Cragun	Sun Microsystems	IEEE OR
Larry Dwyer	HP (teleconference, full)	The Open Group alternate
Mark Brown	IBM	The Open Group OR
Ulrich Drepper	Red Hat
David Clissold	IBM
Geoff Clare	The Open Group (teleconference, full)
Cathy Fox	The Open Group

Andrew Josey called the twelfth meeting (a.k.a. Austin/M13, since this counting includes a teleconference) of the Austin Group to order at 9:35 am Tuesday, February 27th at The IBM facility, Austin, TX.

Meeting Goals

The goal of this meeting is to review draft 2 comments for the 200x revision, and continue processing inbound defect reports so that they can be addressed in draft 3.

The main part of the meeting will be spent doing issue resolution based on Aardvark comments submitted against Draft 2 and also those outstanding on the 2004 edition of the standard was completed. Attendees are assumed to be familiar with the proposed dispositions for the aardvark prior to the attendance of the meeting - these will not be discussed unless there is some disagreement with the proposal.

1. Administrivia
   • Introductions

     All the participants introduced themselves.

   • Approval of Agenda (Austin/339)

     The agenda was approved as published, with the addition of a discussion on approved interpretations/interpretations status (under item 5, Status Reports).

   • Approval of Minutes

     Minutes of the last plenary meeting ( Austin/317, September 12-15, 2006) were reviewed. Approved with no objections.

   • Review of Action Items
     1. ACTION AI-2005-01-01: Don Cragun to present paper on pathname resolution.
        STATUS: Still OPEN - Don still intends to submit this.
     2. ACTION AI-2006-09-01: Ulrich Drepper to prepare a paper making a recommendation on imaginary type in C99.
        STATUS: CLOSED. Ulrich has researched this and believes there is no paper needed. It should not be required to implement imaginary types. Anyone wishing to implement imaginary as defined in Annex G should do so as a non-standard extension.
     3. ACTION AI-2006-09-02: Ulrich and Nick to develop a draft PAR and criteria for C++ POSIX binding for discussion.
        OPEN (in progress). Draft PAR circulated Nov 20 for comment. PMC Criteria still to be developed. Ulrich has sent out a note to remind folks about this, which has sparked some discussion. Deadline for final report from SG is March 31 2007.
     4. ACTION 2006-09-13: Andrew to make a pass through current closed aardvarks against approved std, to move items to SD-5 or interpretations when ready.
        CLOSED for D2R, but ongoing. See Austin/325 for the list of specific changes for D2R from SD/5. Andrew submitted more interpretations into the pipe at the end of January 2007. A new ACTION will be opened at the end of this meeting for D3R.
     5. Action AI-2006-06-01: Andrew to work out the full set of changes for recirculation for XSH ERN 132
        OPEN, ongoing in progress; Wednesday: Andrew gave an update on this action. Various wordsmithing occurred.

   • Review of Issues List

     SD1 Issue 16, ACTION Andrew Josey to talk to IEEE and ITTF about the name to use in the text: is POSIX.1:200x satisfactory to all?

   • Review of Consent List

     SD2 - no updates.

2. Procedures Update
   • JPC Procedures
     No updates to report.

     There was a tabled issue from the last meeting, where Matthew Rice responded to the issues raised at a previous Plenary by Stephen Michelle on the difficulties that Canada has had holding together a group of experts to review documents. At the SC 22 plenary, Stephen Michelle reported that this issue was now resolved to his satisfaction.

     An ISO editing group has been formed (and this meeting is a meeting of the official POSIX editing group).

   • Committee Draft development procedures.

   No updates.

3. Identification of Organizational Reps

   See attendance list above.

4. Status Reports

   • Austin Group Status - Andrew Josey presented Austin/341. Main change since last meeting is that Draft 2 has been produced and balloted.

   • Organizational Reps Status

     • ISO: This is a meeting of the ISO editing group. No PAG meeting will occur this week. Project Editor is Andrew. D2 concurrent CD registration and ballot closed. Unanimous approval for registration. Only US objected to CD ballot. ISO-C will be publishing TC3 this year. They are also considering a revision.
     • IEEE: D2 ballot closed with 91% approval. Lowell was re-elected chair of PASC. New PASC procedures are under discussion.
     • TOG: No new news. A new MLS (multi-level-security) working group is being discussed. High Performance (HECEWG) is working, but nothing to report. Now 4 companies branding UNIX03.

   • IEEE Status
     Study Group on C++ binding must wrap up soon.
   • ISO SC22 Status
     Nothing to report.
   • IEEE/The Open Group Status
     See above.
   • C99 Status.
     See above.
   • Networking Status.
     Nothing to report.
   • Joint Procedures Committee Status
     Nothing new.
   • LSB. Free Standards Group and OSDL have merged to become the Linux Foundation. This should mean that the desktop groups from the two organizations will merge. Should also mean that testsuites will be enhanced.
   • Interpretations and Interpretations Status.
     Interpretations 119, 120 and 121 are currently in "Proposed" status. Wednesday: 120 and 121 have completed their thirty day review state and should be marked as final. 119 has some additional notes from Geoff. No dissent on these. Closed. 117 (m4 maketemp/mkstemp): some comments from Eric Blake received. Minor wordsmithing on these. Changes are only to editors notes ... no need to recirculate (they will be balloted in the next draft). Closed. Interpretations report is available at http://www.opengroup.org/austin/plato/protected/show_mail.tpl?CALLER=show_archive.tpl&source=L&listname=austin-feb2007&id=10&listid=5783, which will become Austin/340.
5. Old business
   Any business brought forward from the teleconference agenda; nothing brought forward from teleconferences. Reviewed recent email discussions, but these should be covered in aardvarks.

6. New business

   • Scope of workplan:

     No updates to scope.

     Document Format The new toolchain is meeting with approval, though there are still a number of issues. ACTION Nick to work with Cathy and Andrew to address cross reference issues. The document should be built as a single PDF book to aid in the production of cross document references.

   • Aardvark Against Draft 2

     Draft 2 was "feature complete", and was balloted by IEEE, ISO/IEC and by The Austin Group general membership. While aardvark counts are not as high as against some previous drafts (e.g. D5 in 2000/2001), there are a good number to work through this week.

     In most cases, the agreed disposition for each of these aardvark is in the relevant aardvark review document. These minutes capture only the highest level information.

     • XBD Aardvark
       
       • ERN 1 Accept
       • ERN 2 Reject; Since the 2001 revision ...
       • ERN 3 Accept with comments. We agree with the balloters comments and have resolved the other objections to the satisfaction of the submitter.
       • ERN 4 Accept with comments. We agree with the balloters comments and have resolved the other objections to the satisfaction of the submitter.
       • ERN 5 Accept with comments. We agree with the balloters comments and have resolved the other objections to the satisfaction of the submitter.
       • ERN 6 Dup of 4
       • ERN 7 Dup of 4
       • ERN 8 Accept with comments. We agree with the balloters comments and have resolved the other objections to the satisfaction of the submitter.
       • ERN 9 Accept
       • ERN 10 Accept as marked. Also update change history.
       • ERN 11 Accept as marked. This is not a normative reference, but rather an informative one. Change XRAT page 5, A1.1, FIPS requirements, lines 92-93 to say ...
       • ERN 12 Accept as marked. The term "Base Character" is only used in text where the common english usage of the term "base" here is adequate. Remove definition for "Base Character". Also add this change to XRAT.
       • ERN 13 Accept
       • ERN 14 Accept
       • ERN 15 Accept
       • ERN 16 Accept
       • ERN 17 Accept
       • ERN 18 Accept
       • ERN 19 Accept
       • ERN 20 Accept
       • ERN 21 Accept
       • ERN 22 Accept
       • ERN 23 Accept
       • ERN 24 Accept
       • ERN 25 Accept
       • ERN 26 Accept
       • ERN 27 Accept
       • ERN 28 Accept
       • ERN 29 Accept
       • ERN 30 Accept
       • ERN 31 Accept
       • ERN 32 Accept
       • ERN 33 Accept
       • ERN 34 Accept
       • ERN 35 Accept as marked: change cpio.h 7399 to "The <cpio.h> header shall define the following symbolic constant as a string:"
       • ERN 36 Accept
       • ERN 37 Accept
       • ERN 38 Reject; this could make the meaning ambiguous. R6.
       • ERN 39 Accept as marked. All references to "open()" should also include "openat()". ACTION Nick to provide Rationale for changes for fcntl.h XBD ERN 39. (done)
       • ERN 40 Accept
       • ERN 41 Accept as marked. Copy text from Rationale for cfgetispeed as an inline note after line 6809 regarding usage of the term "baud".
       • ERN 42 Accept
       • ERN 43 Accept
       • ERN 44 Accept
       • ERN 45 Accept
       • ERN 46 Accept
       • ERN 47 Accept
       • ERN 48 Accept as marked ... add _l to second example.
       • ERN 49 Accept
       • ERN 50 Accept as marked. The WORD_BIT and LONG_BIT definitions were omitted from the aardvark for line 9049. All definitions are suitable for use in #if.
         Tuesday, adjourn
         Wednesday, 9.00amGeoff submitted a minor update to ERN 50; accepted.
       • ERN 51 Accept
       • ERN 52 Accept
       • ERN 53 Accept
       • ERN 54 Accept
       • ERN 55 Accept
       • ERN 56 Accept
       • ERN 57 Accept
       • ERN 58 Accept
       • ERN 59 Accept
       • ERN 60 Accept as marked.
       • ERN 61 Accept
       • ERN 62 Accept
       • ERN 63 Accept
       • ERN 64 Dup of 63
       • ERN 65 Accept
       • ERN 66 Accept as marked
       • ERN 67 Accept as marked
       • ERN 68 Accept as marked
       • ERN 69 Accept
       • ERN 70 Accept
       • ERN 71 Accept
       • ERN 72 Accept
       • ERN 73 Accept
       • ERN 74 Accept
       • ERN 75 Accept
       • ERN 76 Accept
       • ERN 77 Accept
       • ERN 78 Accept
       • ERN 79 Accept
       • ERN 80 Accept
       • ERN 81 Accept
       • ERN 82 Accept as marked
       • ERN 83 Accept
       • ERN 84 Accept
       • ERN 85 Accept as marked (use TEF)
       • ERN 86 OPEN -- no consensus. Either write APP USAGE for wait/waitpid as if wait was obsolete {and waitpid(-1,...)}, or write a general note stating that system interfaces cannot consume process IDs (or file descriptors) without freeing them unless otherwise stated.
       • ERN 87 Accept
       • ERN 88 Accept
       • ERN 89 Accept
       • ERN 90 Accept as marked
       • ERN 91 Accept
       • ERN 92 Accept
       • ERN 93 Accept
       • ERN 94 Accept
       • ERN 95 Accept as marked
       • ERN 96 OPEN -- need to revisit with file timestamp issue discussion.
       • ERN 97 Accept
       • ERN 98 Accept
       • ERN 99 Accept
       • ERN 100 Accept
     • XSH Aardvark
       
       • XSH ERN 1 Accept
       • XSH ERN 2 Accept
       • XSH ERN 3 Accept
       • XSH ERN 4 Accept
       • XSH ERN 5 Accept as marked. waitid() needs to be added to the list after line 1189.
       • XSH ERN 6 OPEN - Larry still has theoretical problems with this
       • XSH ERN 7 Accept
       • XSH ERN 8 Accept
       • XSH ERN 9 Accept
       • XSH ERN 10 Accept
       • XSH ERN 11 Accept
       • XSH ERN 12 Accept
       • XSH ERN 13 Accept
       • XSH ERN 14 Accept
       • XSH ERN 15 Accept as marked (option A)
       • XSH ERN 16 Accept
       • XSH ERN 17 Accept
       • XSH ERN 18 Accept
       • XSH ERN 19 Accept as marked;
       • XSH ERN 20 Accept
       • XSH ERN 21 Reject - dlerror is not thread safe.
       • XSH ERN 22 Accept
       • XSH ERN 23 Accept
       • XSH ERN 24 Accept as marked
       • XSH ERN 25 Accept
       • XSH ERN 26 Accept
       • XSH ERN 27 Accept
       • XSH ERN 28 Accept as marked - use getrlimit()/setrlimit() instead of ulimit().
       • XSH ERN 29 Accept
       • XSH ERN 30 Accept
       • XSH ERN 31 Accept
       • XSH ERN 32 Accept as marked - also mark gets() as OB
       • XSH ERN 33 Accept
       • XSH ERN 34 Reject - not required. However this is a valid extension.
       • XSH ERN 35 Accept as marked (use reading not searching ... global edit) ACTION - Ulrich to research issue 15 and propose text for XSH intro to explain directory searching, with special respect to the *at() functions.
       • XSH ERN 36 Accept
       • XSH ERN 37 Accept
       • XSH ERN 38 Accept as marked (change "if" to "whether")
       • XSH ERN 39 Accept
       • XSH ERN 40 Accept as marked ... editor's discretion permitted
       • XSH ERN 41 Accept
       • XSH ERN 42 Accept as marked ACTION Nick to improve example for XSH ERN 42 (done)
       • XSH ERN 43 Accept
       • XSH ERN 44 Accept as marked
       • XSH ERN 45 Accept
       • XSH ERN 46 Accept
       • XSH ERN 47 Accept
       • XSH ERN 48 Accept
       • XSH ERN 49 Accept
       • XSH ERN 50 Accept
       • XSH ERN 51 Accept
       • XSH ERN 52 Accept
       • XSH ERN 53 Accept
       • XSH ERN 54 Accept
       • XSH ERN 55 Accept
       • XSH ERN 56 Accept
       • XSH ERN 57 Accept
       • XSH ERN 58 Accept
       • XSH ERN 59 Accept
       • XSH ERN 60 Accept
       • XSH ERN 61 Accept
       • XSH ERN 62 Accept
       • XSH ERN 63 Accept
       • XSH ERN 64 Accept
       • XSH ERN 65 Accept
       • XSH ERN 66 Accept
       • XSH ERN 67 Accept
     • XCU Aardvark
       
       • XCU ERN 1 Accept
       • XCU ERN 2 Accept
       • XCU ERN 3 Accept
       • XCU ERN 4 Accept
       • XCU ERN 5 Accept
       • XCU ERN 6 Accept
       • XCU ERN 7 Accept
       • XCU ERN 8 Accept
       • XCU ERN 9 Accept
       • XCU ERN 10 Accept
       • XCU ERN 11 Accept
       • XCU ERN 12 Accept
       • XCU ERN 13 Accept
       • XCU ERN 14 Accept
       • XCU ERN 15 Accept
       • XCU ERN 16 Accept
       • XCU ERN 17 Accept
       • XCU ERN 18 Accept
       • XCU ERN 19 Accept
       • XCU ERN 20 Accept
       • XCU ERN 21 Accept
       • XCU ERN 22 Accept
       • XCU ERN 23 Accept
       • XCU ERN 24 Accept
       • XCU ERN 25 Accept
       • XCU ERN 26 Accept
       • XCU ERN 27 Accept
       • XCU ERN 28 Accept
       • XCU ERN 29 Accept
       • XCU ERN 30 Accept
       • XCU ERN 31 Accept
       • XCU ERN 32 Accept
       • XCU ERN 33 Accept
       • XCU ERN 34 Accept
       • XCU ERN 35 Accept
       • XCU ERN 36 Accept
       • XCU ERN 37 Accept
       • XCU ERN 38 Accept
       • XCU ERN 39 Accept
       • XCU ERN 40 Accept
       • XCU ERN 41 Accept
       • XCU ERN 42 Accept
       • XCU ERN 43 Accept
       • XCU ERN 44 Accept
       • XCU ERN 45 Accept
       • XCU ERN 46 Accept
       • XCU ERN 47 Accept
       • XCU ERN 48 Accept
       • XCU ERN 49 Accept
       • XCU ERN 50 Accept
       • XCU ERN 51 Accept
       • XCU ERN 52 Accept
       • XCU ERN 53 Accept
       • XCU ERN 54 Accept
       • XCU ERN 55 Accept
       • XCU ERN 56 Accept
       • XCU ERN 57 Accept
       • XCU ERN 58 Accept
       • XCU ERN 59 Accept
       • XCU ERN 60 Accept
       • XCU ERN 61 Accept
       • XCU ERN 62 Accept
       • XCU ERN 63 Accept
       • XCU ERN 64 Accept
       • XCU ERN 65 Accept
       • XCU ERN 66 Accept
       • XCU ERN 67 Accept
       • XCU ERN 68 OPEN -- ACTION Mark Brown to produce sample pages with various ways of presenting c99 information, including synopsis changes, Geoff Clare's proposal, and no change, and to circulate these pages. ACTION, ALL review sample c99 pages when available with an audience that includes non standards developers.
       • XCU ERN 69 Accept
       • XCU ERN 70 Accept
       • XCU ERN 71 Accept
       • XCU ERN 72 Accept
       • XCU ERN 73 Accept
       • XCU ERN 74 Accept
       • XCU ERN 75 Accept as marked
       • XCU ERN 76 Accept
       • XCU ERN 77 Accept
       • XCU ERN 78 Accept
       • XCU ERN 79 Accept
       • XCU ERN 80 Accept
       • XCU ERN 81 Accept
       • XCU ERN 82 Accept
       • XCU ERN 83 Accept
       • XCU ERN 84 Accept
       • XCU ERN 85 Accept
       • XCU ERN 86 Accept
       • XCU ERN 87 Accept
       • XCU ERN 88 Accept as marked (change "file system" to "file hierarchy")
       • XCU ERN 89 Accept
       • XCU ERN 90 Accept
       • XCU ERN 91 Accept
       • XCU ERN 92 Accept
       • XCU ERN 93 Accept
       • XCU ERN 94 Accept
       • XCU ERN 95 Accept
       • XCU ERN 96 Accept
       • XCU ERN 97 Accept
       • XCU ERN 98 Accept
       • XCU ERN 99 Accept
       • XCU ERN 100 Accept
       • XCU ERN 101 Accept as marked
       • XCU ERN 102 Accept
       • XCU ERN 103 Accept
       • XCU ERN 104 Accept as marked ... basically do nothing, but change "extensions" to "XSI".
       • XCU ERN 105 Accept
       • XCU ERN 106 Accept
       • XCU ERN 107 Accept
       • XCU ERN 108 Accept
       • XCU ERN 109 Accept
       • XCU ERN 110 Accept
       • XCU ERN 111 Accept
       • XCU ERN 112 Accept
       • XCU ERN 113 Accept -- there may be editorial reasons why we can't do this.
       • XCU ERN 114 Accept
       • XCU ERN 115 Accept
       • XCU ERN 116 Accept
       • XCU ERN 117 Accept
       • XCU ERN 118 Accept
       • XCU ERN 119 Accept
       • XCU ERN 120 Accept
       • XCU ERN 121 Accept
       • XCU ERN 122 Accept
       • XCU ERN 123 Accept
       • XCU ERN 124 Accept
       • XCU ERN 125 Accept
       • XCU ERN 126 Accept
       • XCU ERN 127 Accept
       • XCU ERN 128 Accept
       • XCU ERN 129 Accept
       • XCU ERN 130 Accept
       • XCU ERN 131 Accept
       • XCU ERN 132 Accept
       • XCU ERN 133 Accept
       • XCU ERN 134 Accept
       • XCU ERN 135 Accept
       • XCU ERN 136 Accept
       • XCU ERN 137 Accept
       • XCU ERN 138 Accept as marked (editorial license permitted)
       • XCU ERN 139 Accept
       • XCU ERN 140 Accept
       • XCU ERN 141 Accept
       • XCU ERN 142 Accept
     • XRAT Aardvark
       
       • XRAT ERN 1 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 2 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 3 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 4 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 5 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 6 Accept as marked -- use both examples.
       • XRAT ERN 7 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 8 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 9 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 10 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 11 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 12 Accept
       • XRAT ERN 13 Accept
   • Fine Grain File Timestamps

     In the 2004 aardvark, XSH ERN 138 discusses the addition of a new function posix_utimens_at, that is capable of setting file timestamps to nano-second granularity. This function is invention, but it similar to utimes() or futimesat() (both of which allow only micorosecond accuracy).

     Additionally, XBD ERN 72 (which has already been marked as accepted) introduces nanosecond precision timestamps in the stat structure. ACTION: Nick Stoughton to develop a comprehensive set of aardvarks to capture all editing instructions relating to fine-grain timestamps by March 31.

     New function name: should it be posix_utimensat, futimensat, or utimensat? Consensus is utimensat. Both utime and utimes are OB, and futimesat is removed from the standard.
     AGREED: Add a new function, utimensat(int fd, const char * file, const struct timespec tsp[2]) with the same specification as futimesat(), except for the use of a timespec rather than timeval structure. Drop the futimesat() interface. Mark both utime() and utimes() as OB, with Application Usage pointing to utimensat().

   • Toolchain Update

     We should move to producing a single PDF, and not four concatenated ones. This will involve changing the way we do cross-volume references. Single table of contents and index. ACTION Cathy to produce an unofficial draft showing examples of how a single pdf would look, including some limited examples of cross volume references.

   • POSIX Certification Status Report

     Andrew presented a status report on certification (Austin/342).

   • Work Plan Update

     Original work plan had draft 3 in May, draft 4 in August and draft 5 in December. Draft 4 is not needed. draft 3 can go out later -- June.

7. Consent List:
   Updated with finegrain timestamps new function; number 44.

8. Issues List
   No changes.

9. Action Item Review
   1. ACTION AI-2005-01-01: Don Cragun to present paper on pathname resolution.
   2. ACTION AI-2006-09-02: Ulrich and Nick to develop a draft PAR and criteria for C++ POSIX binding for discussion, and to produce the Study Group final report by March 31.
   3. Action AI-2006-06-01: Andrew to work out the full set of changes for recirculation for XSH ERN 132
      OPEN, ongoing in progress; Wednesday: Andrew gave an update on this action. Various wordsmithing occurred.
   4. ACTION 2007-02-01: Andrew Josey to make a pass through current closed aardvarks against approved std, to move items to SD-5 or interpretations when ready.
   5. ACTION 2007-02-02: Andrew Josey to talk to IEEE and ITTF about the name to use in the text: is POSIX.1:200x satisfactory to all?
   6. ACTION 2007-02-03: Nick to work with Cathy and Andrew to address cross reference issues. The document should be built as a single PDF book to aid in the production of cross document references.
      Mostly done, but some spacing issues remain.
   7. ACTION 2007-02-04: Nick to provide Rationale for changes.
      DONE
   8. ACTION 2007-02-05: Nick to provide Rationale for changes for fcntl.h XBD ERN 39.
      DONE
   9. ACTION 2007-02-06: Ulrich to research issue 15 and propose text for XSH intro to explain directory searching, with special respect to the *at() functions.
   10. ACTION 2007-02-07: Nick to improve example for XSH ERN 42
       DONE
   11. ACTION 2007-02-08: Mark Brown to produce sample pages with various ways of presenting c99 information, including synopsis changes, Geoff Clare's proposal, and no change, and to circulate these pages.
   12. ACTION 2007-02-09: ALL review sample c99 pages when available with an audience that includes non standards developers.
   13. ACTION 2007-02-10: Nick Stoughton to develop a comprehensive set of aardvarks to capture all editing instructions relating to fine-grain timestamps by March 31.
   14. ACTION 2007-02-11: Cathy to produce an unofficial draft showing examples of how a single pdf would look, including some limited examples of cross volume references.
10. Draft & Meeting Schedule

    Draft 3 will go for 4 month FCD ballot June 15, 60 day IEEE and Austin Group review. We should have a face-to-face in September 2007. Propose Open Group offices in Reading, UK, September 4-7.

    Draft 4 is scheduled for December; this is intended to be the final yes/no ballot (FDIS).

11. AOB
    1. All members of the Austin Group wish to thank IBM for hosting this meeting, feeding us well, and generally taking care of our needs so dutifully.

    The meeting adjourned at 12:27, Thursday, March 1.

    ---

    If you have comments or additions relating to the correctness of the Minutes please send them to The Austin Group Chair. If your comments relate to decisions regarding the disposition of the aardvark please refer first to the Aardvark reports, and then if you still have a comment please send it to the main reflectors so that all can see the issue.